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Palo Alto may soon take a formal stance against California’s proposed high-speed-rail line and begin lobbying state legislators to kill the voter-approved project.
Councilman Larry Klein suggested Monday that Palo Alto join the growing chorus of cities and agencies that now oppose the proposed high-speed-rail system, which would connect San Francisco to Los Angeles.
Klein, who chairs the Palo Alto City Council’s High-Speed Rail Committee, said at the Monday evening committee meeting that he believes it’s time for the city to throw its weight against the rail project.
The four-member committee didn’t vote on Klein’s informal proposal but may do so Thursday morning, at its next scheduled meeting.
But other committee members shared Klein’s growing skepticism over the project. Palo Alto Mayor Pat Burt and Councilwoman Nancy Shepherd said they expect the controversial project to die because of lack of funding and predicted that the Peninsula segment of the line would not get constructed any time in the near future.
Klein said the city should formally declare that it has “no confidence” in the California High-Speed Rail Authority under the current process and with the current board of directors in place. He also said the city should begin lobbying the state legislature to halt the project.
Palo Alto, Klein said, should now consider high-speed rail as a “threat to our community — not just our community but the region and indeed the state.” He also painted a “nightmare” scenario in which the rail authority forces the city to either pass a bond and spend hundreds of millions of dollars to build underground tunnels for the trains or find itself burdened with an “unacceptable” rail design, which could include at-grade or elevated tracks.
“My patience is exhausted,” Klein said. “We tried to work with the High-Speed Rail Authority — we and the other agencies are just finding that we’re being stonewalled by the Authority.”
Klein’s proposal is a stunning turnaround for a council member who less than two years ago joined the council in passing a resolution that urged Palo Altans to support Proposition 1A, which authorized $9.95 billion for the rail line. Since then, the council’s enthusiasm for the rail line has gradually waned as members struggled to get answers from the rail authority or to exert influence over the project.
Klein was one of several committee members who said he was concerned about the rail authority’s Aug. 6 application for federal funds, which outlines a “phasing” plan for construction of the rail line. Under the plan, the rail authority would build four-track systems in the north and south portions of the Peninsula segment and leave the Midpeninsula with the existing two-track, at-grade system. The plan uses an unpopular aerial viaduct structure to get four tracks through Mountain View and Sunnyvale.
Rail authority’s CEO Roelof van Ark sent Peninsula cities a letter last week claiming that despite the application, the rail’s design has not been predetermined, but the letter did little to ease the Palo Alto council’s anxiety.
Mayor Burt also said he was worried about the project’s impact on property values along the Caltrain corridor. The rail authority is scheduled to release a long-anticipated environmental impact report for the San Francisco-to-San Jose segment of the line in December. Burt considered a scenario in which the report gets certified, but the project never gets implemented because of inadequate funding. This, he said, would drive down local property values even if nothing gets built.
“We need to consider what Larry is proposing and really anticipate that our next important battle and most achievable one is to unite as Peninsula cities to insist that the project EIR not race ahead when there are no dollars on the horizon to implement it,” Burt said.
Hooray for Palo Alto – what’s taking Mtn. View so long to “see the light” and come out against this badly planned rail project!
Larry Klein is a hero. Its time to call a spade a spade. The only people hot to push this boondoggle through are the people who’s PERSONAL PAYCHECKS depend on it going through. They don’t care what you or your grand kids will be stuck with visually as well as financially. The whole thing is rotten from the lies about ridership expectations to the route and its time to end the charade. Sorry HSR Authority, its time to spruce up your resume. I won’t mortgage my grandchild’s future for your paycheck.
how many LA to SF trains will be running in a day?
Perish the thought that California should do anything that might impact property values. Cars and freeways are so much more energy efficient and visually appealing. Everyone knows that high speed rail can’t possibly work.
Brent C, its not a comment about the technology, its a comment about a horrible plan for this particular project. I mean, just the fact that they had to lie about the ridership to sneak it past voters should set off alarm bells. I’m all in favor of a HSR corridor for the state, but one that makes sense and is based upon realistic ridership estimates.
Free Food for all sounds good too, until you find out what’s actually IN the food.
HSR may work. What we are asking for is a well thought out plan based on the best estimates of ridership and cost that are available. In addition, the California High-Speed Rail Authority MUST consider the impact on the cities it goes through. The goal is to be benefit to California, not a drag on California. Unfortunately, the California High-Speed Rail Authority has taken a position of full speed ahead – damn the torpedoes.
“Klein’s proposal is a stunning turnaround for a council member who less than two years ago joined the council in passing a resolution that urged Palo Altans to support Proposition 1A, which authorized $9.95 billion for the rail line.”
Better late than never. Mean time the Mtn View City Council is still star-struck by the rail station that the HSR Authority (sounds like something from “1984”) is dangling in front of them. Perhaps they all hope to get their names on it.
But it will never be built. It is still not too late for the Council to do the right thing and try to stop this thing before the “Authority” p*sses away the $10 billion and the CA taxpayers have nothing to show for it.
Hasn’t anybody proposed running the new rail line along I-280? I mean, it doesn’t have to stop in every city, just SF and SJ on its way to LA. I-280 seems like a perfect route, wouldn’t impact property values, and have minimal “eminent domain” impact since there’s hardly any residential or commercial property along that route.
Folks,
At least the Mtn Vw City Council has not traded sides, they are holding out for better information. If you want to complain about the lack of specificity in HSR’s info, blame CEQA. It is illegal to do detailed engineering until a project has environmental approval. I’ve lived within 1000 feet of Caltrain since 1962, up and down the Peninsula. HSR is the only way we get electrified, grade separated, sustainable rail service. A covered trench HSR would require huge fan houses like BART’s along the Embarcadero, and the fans run 24/7. Since we won’t build more freeway lanes or runways either, the choice we make for future generations is to get out in front, or to have congestion rule our lives, or to believe in a Jettson’s future of flying cars, and video conferencing. Since tourism is a big part of our state’s economy, why do people come here instead of just watching on the Discovery channel? For the same reason face to face commerce will not be obsolete.
The hardest part is the details of construction, but HSR can’t develop those yet, so if you want it to go away, “be careful what you wish for”!
And I can remember when 280 opened, with its extra-wide center median designed to accommodate BART, but San Mateo County voters didn’t want it in their backyard. After all, what was the point? There weren’t enough peninsulans to justify it – especially with the SP line already in place. Fast forward 40 years later and a nearly tripled population…can you imagine what our area would be like now if that had been approved? Add 40 years of other improvements/changes to the infrastructure that would have complemented a BART line to San Jose – how about cross lines connecting Caltrain to BART? So, we eliminate HSP…and just what will the increased population of 40 years hence think of our decisions today?
Those who oppose this HST are simply not-in-our-backyard Luddites. I’ve lived both in Palo Alto and Mountain View, and greatly prefer the latter, because I can get by completely without a car. And this is truly what this argument is all about. Does the peninsula want to continue to support a car-dominated dysfunctional transportation system, or look to sustainable alternatives? I have been on a HST a few times, and every time I ask myself, “what’s taken America so long to develop this?” Fast, efficient, convenient, without all the stress of air travel. Come on P.A. get your heads out of your rears, and get on board.
Frankly, I don’t get adding another massive, expensive system when we have not adequately invested, developed, and promoted the regional transit system we have. It’s time we did, and start making a real local (bay area) impact on our over reliance on cars and oil before thinking about hooking up a massive, costly regional and national system during a time when we are already over extended. Let’s focus on seeing real benefits/pay-off from the mass transit we have NOW!
The population will growth in SF Bay Area. That forces the region to be developed. Like it or not, more buildings has been put up alone 237, and 101.
Why has this taken so long, Mountain View should join Palo Alto in stopping this terrible project. The airlines can take us to LA or anywhere in the world for no future taxpayer money. This project will cost the Taxpayers $100B plus the interest on the bonds, think how much the total will be, sort of like a house mortgage.
Please Mountain View help stop High Speed Rail
It’s always VERY EASY to oppose the right thing because it requires some tradeoffs, forward-looking thought, or investment in the future. That’s why we don’t have BART in Santa Clara and San Mateo counties today – now that we realize that deciding against it 40 years ago was a horrific mistake.
Running HSR along 280 will not work. Imagine trying to negotiate the curves and hills of 280 at 125MPH! In Germany, HSR rights-of-way had to be developed from scratch (as opposed to using existing roads or rail lines) in order to make them flat and straight enough to accommodate the necessary speed. You may want to violate the HSR authority’s planned alignment, but you can’t violate the laws of physics. Aside from that, putting even one station along 280 will require all the local access roads to be upgraded since access to 280 from the peninsula/101 is heavily constrained. If you think the NIMBYs are complaining now, wait until you hear the cries of fear and self-righteousness as the residents of Portola Valley, Palo Alto, Los Altos Hills, or the hills of San Mateo gear up to fight the necessary arterials, parking lots and other changes to support a mid-peninsula station. It took Palo Alto 30 years of hand-wringing just to make Sand Hill Road connect with El Camino and even then they goofed that up by not connecting it to Alma. Now try pushing another 50% more traffic through that!
The rest of you complainers are rebreathing your own waste in a fishbowl. The public voted for the project not because of this or that study, but because they wanted to ride it. If your local politicians choose to fight it, they’ll have to deal with an angry public (minus the minority of vocal NIMBYs) who are sick of politicians ignoring their wishes.
Oh, and Rodger, the airlines have been loaded with subsidies. Bailouts from the government, subsidized runways, airports and access roads, and subsidized fuel. With oil projected at up to $500/bbl by 2018, do you really think those airlines will be affordable for the average traveller? Hardly.
I agree with NICK, KEN, and the poster before me. “Come on P.A. get your heads out of your rears, and get on board”
think.
We didn’t vote for HSR “at any oost”. The project is a costly non-commercial enterprise that will connect a few cities. HSR works in other places because it is part of an overall communication network. What good is it to arrive in downtown L.A. and then have to rely on rental cars to get around,
Also, HSR is a high visibility target for terorism. We can defend airplanes at the cockpit and a perimeter aound boarding gates, but rail is another story- It can be attacked anywhere along the route. Are we prepared to be deploy security all along the tracks?
And what’s the environmental impact of a derailment? HSR is very safe, but it’s only a matter of time before there is a major accident along a populated area.
There are many other reasons for not building this system. Air transport is much cheaper, and is getting less expensive with new aairplanes and better engines.
terrorism??
come on now. You mean Bushism or Dick Cheneyism.
Another possible scenario
2010 Meg Whitman gets elected in November and kills the High Speed Rail project
2012-2013 Caltrain runs out of public fund and declare bankruptcy
2015 Bankruptcy court auctions out the Clatrain right-of-way
2016 A private equity group buys the right-of-way
2017 Atherton, Melno-Park and possibly Palo Alto agree to rezone the right-of-way for commercial and residential real estate development
2020 The rest of the peninsula cities follow suit rezoning the entire right of way for development
2020-2025 hundreds of thousands of construction jobs are created to build up the former right of way as a commercial/residential area
2025 The former right-of-way becomes the most trendy area in the peninsula and everyone lives happily ever after
To answer the earlier question about how often the trains will run…
The Authority published a draft schedule with the following:
San Francisco and L.A. (each direction):
* Peak hours: trains will leave every 9 minutes in each direction
* Off-peak hours: trains will leave every 11 minutes in each direction
See: http://www.cahighspeedrail.ca.gov/library.asp?p=8200
The trains likely will run more often the more popular the system gets. In Germany, trains may run as little as 2 minutes apart.
According to the Authority environmental reports, high speed trains at 125 MPH are the same loudness as diesel trains at 80 MPH. In addition, the sound travels twice as far on elevated platforms. See the Bay Area to Central Valley EIR/EIS 3.4-10.
And for geeks in the crowd, “[s]peed has a strong influence on noise in the medium speedrange, usually about 30 times the logarithm of train speed.” Los Angeles to San Diego via Inland Empire Noise and Vibration Technical Evaluation EIR/EIS
BTW: Do not count on the Authority and high speed rail folding for lack of money. The next time gas prices spike (they will), it will find the money.
2025 The former right-of-way becomes the most trendy area in the peninsula and everyone lives happily ever after…
2025.1 Hwy. 101 becomes a massive parking lot forcing CA to build another elevated freeway down Page Mill Rd. and Woodside Rd. causing massive traffic jams on Hwy. 280. Plans are revisited for BART on 280 more than 50 years after they were initially proposed.
C’mon people get with the program or move to Florida/Arizona with the rest of the old farts that don’t like change.
An elevated track doesn’t have to “open-air” or ugly they can put up sound barriers and OLED screens that mimic the sky.
Larry Klein and company would vote for HSR in a minute if the whiners in Palo Alto got everything they wanted but the entire city of Mtn View had to be bulldozed to make it work. The HSR will eventually cave to Palo Alto, give them their tunnel, but screw MV and probably Menlo Park over in the process.
The passive MV city council that thinks that having a monstrous traffic-magnet HSR station obliterate part of downtown is in your best interests needs to wake up and get a reality check. Instead, they’ll just check with google on how they’re supposed to vote on HSR and move on from there.
If you want Mtn View to become a sea of high density traffic gridlock, this council is for you!
There is HOPE,
The City of MV fools, of this will be good for the city can think yet alone learn.
Build the LA t o Sac line and have the SF line come over the Altamont pass where people want it.
Please do not self destruct the way of life we enjoy here in the bay area.
I’m damn glad we don’t have BART down the Peninsula. Best decision regarding transit in the last 40 yrs.